>>/blue/23156 brought up a pretty good idea, so let's give it a go and see how it works out.
This is the thread for all writers who want critique (despite the title, yes, real critique) hurled their way based off of their posted work. Put your name on, link your story, and wait for anon to roast. Easy peasy.
And since it'd be kind of silly to start off a thread without, y'know, contributing to its premise, I'll go ahead and offer my own work up for roasting. Sure, it's dead, but go ahead and roast away anyway: >>/youkai/28957
I'd critique OP's story but I'm not sure I want to do that with my name on, and my memory is even shittier than my writing so I'd have to re-read it, and my life is even shittier than my memory so I don't got time for that shit, because I'm already wasting time posting this when I should be updating.
- Latest update has WAY too many people talking. It's difficult to achieve immersion when the reader is forced to change perspective 20 times in a single update.
-Your vote options are arbitrary and vauge. Which is good for authors, since you can just do whatever while maintaining the illusion of choice. It's bad for readers, though. I've seen this in most of the recent stories, and it greatly upsets me.
-So far, you characters are just kinda walking and talking to each other. I'd much prefer if the story progressed to some kind of conflict. Which is to say, some event to tie in elements of rising and falling action.
-You mentioned weak character development in your initial post. I'd say it's way too soon to come to that conclusion. Focus on scaling down the number of characters per scene, and work on highlighting the differences among them.
-Your mentioned not being able to plot your way out of a paper bag. I don't agree. You've given us multiple hints and lose ends pointing twords a fleshed out world. I'd say you've started out well in the plot department.
Finally! Thank you very much for taking the time to post this.
> Latest update has WAY too many people talking. > Focus on scaling down the number of characters per scene, and work on highlighting the differences among them.
Nix the crowds. Got it.
> Your vote options are arbitrary and vauge.
Sorry, didn't even realize I was doing that. They are actually supposed to mean something, I just got carried away with a dumb stylistic gimmick.
> Your mentioned not being able to plot your way out of a paper bag. I don't agree. You've given us multiple hints and lose ends pointing twords a fleshed out world. I'd say you've started out well in the plot department.
That's not plot, that's worldbuilding. I like worldbuilding. But keeping the story engaging takes more than just knowing a character's past and motivations. The bit where you go from fantasy simulator to entertaining read still escapes me.
I can write in the other direction, taking all the mechanics and rules they teach you in writing school to build a story and then fleshing out the details around it, but that kills the freedom of voting. I'm still sorta stuck in the transition between regular writer and CYOA writer.
> So far, you characters are just kinda walking and talking to each other. I'd much prefer if the story progressed to some kind of conflict. Which is to say, some event to tie in elements of rising and falling action.
And this is what I meant about the plot: everything I write turns into slice-of-life. How can I work conflict and action into a story like this? Other than stupid shit like having Seki go all tsundere and duel Kagerou or something, I got nothing. I think I need some lessons in subtlety.
>>14860 >How can I work conflict and action into a story like this? I believe ideally that's something you think of before you start writing and posting.
Plotless stories were only a thing when the CYOA format was novel and updates were fast. To be honest few things make me drop a story faster than the kind of meandering that comes from lacking a central goal or conflict.
1. Viable, show-stopping rival love interests. Consider how Flandre and Rumia's dominant personalities in Gensokyo High led to them taking center stage in their respective scenes, leading to a very powerful reader response as we identified and honed in on key traits we find favorable in a love interest.
2. Respect the tropes. Consider how ToY uses the popular Visual Novel archetypes to it's advantage. Ice Queen Reimu, Bad Girl Tenshi, and Childhood Friend Alice are all examples of things that work. I'm not saying you should copy that; per say, but think about characters that "work" for you, and try to envision that girl/guy as a character.
3. Conflict. Literally. Having the girls subtly aware of potential enemies leads to the explosive confrontations that readers want to see. Whether it be verbal, physical, direct, or indirect confrontations: I can guarantee readers love this shit.
>>14863 Read it to critique it, ended up upset that I didn't read this before due to my general lack of attraction towards AU stories. Very enjoyable, does a lot of things right. Characters and interactions are fun to read and distinctive, moves at a good clip, prose flows nicely. Kind of reminds me of one of those Dresden Files books, and those are massive commercial successes so you know that's a good thing.
Without it being finished I can't offer many meaningful comments on the plot but it kept my interest and isn't predictable (to me, anyway) and that's all one can ask for. Really I only have one major complaint and a few nitpicks, and those are out of the realm of "this is objectively bad and you should change it" and into "I really think changing this would have improved the story, but in the end it's debatable"
It's not something that can really be 'fixed' at this point but there's one thing I think would have turned it from an enjoyable read to a real 'page turner' as you'd call it. A story where you're constantly eager to find out what happens next and f5 the thread several times a day, and it's nothing complex or crazy. It's the basic storytelling elements of a clear looming threat and clear antagonist.
First up is a real antagonist. Say, seeing the Tenma and/or some kind of tengu figurehead do clearly evil stuff to the people of the city two or three times, darth vader style, would really fuel that feeling of righteous anger in the reader. Right now they're a vague background threat that we're told are bad. Sure the main character gets attacked by one of them, once, but something a little beyond that would be good, I think. It focuses the story. I know there's Kotohime, but again she's kind of nebulous in her capabilities and threat level on top of being some kind of spirit/thought-form/whatever and we're not 100% sure what her deal is.
Same thing with a looming threat, a real stake, a ticking clock. This will probably happen harder later in the story, but until now it hasn't been there. Somewhere around the end of the first act is where this would usually surface, then the stakes would be raised again later: rather than just sleuthing at their own pace and dealing with trouble as they come to it, something happens that forces them into action at first, then into urgent action later! Suwako realizes some kind of magical thingamabob Kanako used to bind her is slowly corroding away her power for unknown nefarious purposes, and the effect might be fatal! Boom, instantly there's tension, motivation, drama. Oh no, the Tengu are kicking their search into overdrive for some reason, kicking doors down in the slums and spreading the word about the fugitives - with rewards attached! Suddenly they can't calmly walk the streets anymore!
Of course these are just silly examples, but you get what I mean. Unless this turns out to be a very, very long story, fantasy epic style, and we're early in it, I'd expect to be seeing some of those elements pop up by now. Instead the stakes and driving forces we had were: finding Shizuha to pay for a mild debt. Investigate a soup kitchen because it's suspicious. Help the goddesses raise faith because we like them and the way of the tengu is worse in some vague way that we don't have concrete examples of.
I'm a fan of structure in stories, because it's tried and true for a very good reason. This story is the story of a private investigator with a dark past in a scummy city. There's action, there's romance, there's adventure, there's banter. I'm approaching this critique with the mindset that your goal was this genre, a fun adventure romp in the style of the good old commercial novel. And I'd say it's successful, but lacking that final push to become a real masterpiece. The lack of those elements does result in a story feeling slightly more relaxed and opening up space for more exploration of other areas, and if that's the goal, fantastic. But reading it, I felt like it would have been truly exciting and unique for THP with the action push, more like a traditional detective-fiction-adventure thing, and it would have fit right in with all the other elements for a story worth of a real publisher, fanfiction aside.
But that's why it's just, like, my opinion, man.
Still, I'd rank this up there and I'll definitely keep reading in the future. If you got this far, thanks for reading my rant. I didn't edit it too much.
>>14868 >First up is a real antagonist. Say, seeing the Tenma and/or some kind of tengu figurehead do clearly evil stuff to the people of the city two or three times, darth vader style, would really fuel that feeling of righteous anger in the reader. Right now they're a vague background threat that we're told are bad. Sure the main character gets attacked by one of them, once, but something a little beyond that would be good, I think. It focuses the story. I know there's Kotohime, but again she's kind of nebulous in her capabilities and threat level on top of being some kind of spirit/thought-form/whatever and we're not 100% sure what her deal is.
Not every story has to have a Final Ultimate Bad Guy and in my opinion, this kind of story would benefit more from not rushing along the plot like that.
>Same thing with a looming threat, a real stake, a ticking clock. This will probably happen harder later in the story, but until now it hasn't been there.
A threat of getting shot by Rinnosuke was real enough.
>>14867 Your story is pretty good. I don't have any major problems with it. I do have a small nitpick about your main character's appearance though.
Near the beginning, it is revealed that your main character was born with black holes for eyeballs, thus rendering her blind. I don't have any problem with that, she is Hina's daughter so I can understand why something like this could happen, and having the story told from the perspective of a blind person could be interesting. However, after it is revealed that she was born with black holes for eyeballs, the very next sentence reveals that Hina created magical Deus ex Machina eyeballs that let the main character see just as well as anyone else.
Doing this completely defeats the point of giving your character black hole eyeballs. Its sort of like giving your character a tail, and then also giving them magic pants that makes the tail disappear so they can sit in chairs just like everyone else. If a reader wanted to, they could skip the sentence that revealed the black hole eyeballs, and it would have absolutely no impact on the plot at all.
It is mentioned that the eyes that Hina magicked up allow your character to see the essence of misfortune and make her look unsettling. This could have just as easily been an intrinsic property of the black hole eyeballs themselves. Someone with black holes for eyes would certainly be unsettling, and magic black hole eyes are enough justification for the ability to see misfortune all on their own.
But that's really just a minor nitpick and really isn't all that much of an issue.
>>14874 In that case, the problem lies in the fact that you were too poetic for your own good. Lets look at the actual quote:
>I was born blind, with nothing but great disgusting voids where my eyes were supposed to go
"Great disgusting voids" sounds really cool and poetic, but is also misleading since I interpreted this literally, as in "horrifying all consuming black holes of infinitely dark swirling nothingness instead of normal eyeballs."
Poetic descriptions can really spice up your story, but you also have to be careful not to go overboard, or you risk making it harder for your readers to know whats actually happening. Saying something like, "I was born without eyes, with nothing but two vacant holes in my skull where my eyes should have been, leaving me completely blind," would have been descriptive enough to get the point across with less risk of being misinterpreted.
Took a few mins to read this. I can defnintivly say that this:
>“Sorry, but my past is not something I want to go too deeply into, especially not when it comes to the Mansion's residents.”
is probably what happened. That was literally what I was hanging on the edge of my seat to find out after that very sudden and unexplained fight. I can only imagine the intense dissatisfaction felt by the readers following your story from it's conception.
Excellent storytelling and pacing. However, your MC leaves much to be desired. I understand his personality, merits, and flaws are derived from the basic "Anon" type character typicaly seen in greentext stories and 4chan culture. However, that type of thing isn't really conducive with feature length stories. I felt his character development hit a glass ceiling somewhere around thread 2, which was a shame, since Momiji's character is particularly well-written. In closing, I can definitely see why this story still has a strong following even after three years, but it's just not my cup of tea.
Also, that Aya interlude in thread 3 almost made me ragequit my reading marathon. Good show sir.
>>14880 I'll add to this and say that An Excuse for Temporary Word suffers greatly for being written in second person perspective. Gallagay is enough of a character on his own to warrant a narrative acknowledging his independence, and while I understand the tradition behind such-and-not-another choice of perspective, I do bemoan - bemoan! - it.
>>14868 Thank you for reading and critiquing; I'm glad you enjoyed it!
I understand what you mean by the story lacking a clear antagonist or a looming threat. I think I've introduced a lot of antagonistic figures without having them actually do anything to prove them as such to the reader, and as you mentioned, that has resulted in a lack of focus when it comes to the overarching plot. However, I do still consider the story to be in its beginning stages, so I believe there's time to rectify these issues without it feeling too forced (I had already hinted at things getting worse for PI in the latest update, and they will certainly continue to do so).
I think if I had more experience or were more confident I would have started with the kind of intense, page-turner story you were talking about, but instead I settled for something a little safer. I'm not proud of that, but I don't necessarily regret it either. As you mentioned, it's more of a subjective issue and not everyone will have the same opinion (as proven by >>14869, whose input I also appreciate).
Again, thank you for taking the time to write all that. It was extremely helpful in sorting out my thoughts moving forward. I hope I'll keep you reading until the end.
>>14858 I think the major problem with your story is that it appears to be a sequel. A sequel to an older story of yours that itself has not yet been completed. People generally do not like reading a sequel without first finishing the prequel. And it sounds like a lot of interesting stuff happened in the prequel, what with people talking about how Kogasa murdered a man in cold blood and Sekibanki hooked up with her because of it. Boy howdy, I bet that would have been fun to read. To bad we can't read it since it hasn't been written, and even you did write it the plot twist is totally spoiled now.
Its kind of like if someone started watching the second star wars movie, and then stopped watching it halfway through in order to start watching the third movie. When they stopped watching the second movie, everyone had just arrived in Cloud City, but then they start watching the third movie and suddenly Han Solo is frozen in carbonite and everyone is talking about how Darth Vader is Luke's father. They can't enjoy the third movie as much because they don't know how all this happened and can't understand whats going on, and they can't enjoy the second movie as much since now they know spoilers.
Its pretty much always a good idea to finish writing your stories before you consider writing a sequel for it.
>>14880 >>14882 I agree with the both of you. From what I've gleamed, it's really the second person perspective that is the crux of the problem. If I knew what I was doing at the time of the story's conception, I probably would have made it third person instead. An Excuse for A-Who is too far in now, but I suppose it's something to take note for future stories.
>>14884 >People generally do not like reading a sequel without first finishing the prequel. h-haha yeah who would make a sequel for a story that isn't even finished yet right guys
>>14887 Ah, It seems what I was worried of is what happened. He can't 'control time' per say. More work on a 60fps while the world is running at 24fps. As shown with the Sakuya fight, He's nothing compared to an actual time controller. Had he not been speeding up to try and get away, Sakuya wouldn't have even had a fight, she woulda just curb stomped him.
Seems I need to get more into the purple prose when it comes to explaining things.
Hm. I should take that into consideration then. I've always been of the thought that even the best works have something to improve on, and mine is no different.
As to the reason I was looking for criticism in the first place, what would you have to say on the matter of the last vote? Should I go back and explain the vote a bit more, or give a chance for anon to get the story if they want it, or should I simply continue on with 'that's how anon voted'
I admit I may care a little too much about votes, but going from 4 to 1 kinda threw me for a loop.
Unless your storyline is tied to a clearly defined timetable(e.g you can do whatever you want this month so long as you infiltrate the palace and steal the treasure before October 22nd a la Persona 5), you shouldn't have eat and sleep as options. If you're doing a good job as an author, both should fall into the natural pace of storytelling. Eating alone is also a bad vote option. I feel like you intentionally made these options undesirable because you wanted to write a Shou scene.
My advise is threefold;
1. Asking in thread why people didn't vote might lead to some people besides myself revealing why they didn't like the past updates.
2. Continue updating for a bit, and try to feel out where reader response lies.
3. If neither of the above work, you should probably stop writing the story.
>>14891 Mh. Thanks for the advice anon. Imma see what anyone says, and go back to the drawing board to see what if my plans needs possible tune up. If nothing else, I guess I'll get the next part out with one vote.
1. Significantly less cliché and cringy than I expected. You've definitely gained another reader.
2. Storytelling is fluid despite conflicting and dynamic vote options. Go ahead and give yourself a pat on the back for this one.
3. Protagonist presents a welcome challenge to the form. The fact that gods in the Touhou setting have strengths, weaknesses, fears, dreams, and aspirations is something this community hasn't explored nearly enough.
4. Tolerable OC. I found his overly blasé personality kept a natural and appropriate pace with the plot. I very much expected one to completely overshadow the other and make me drop the story.
1. Let's just pretend those first few updates never happened.
2. A worryingly high number of the comedic moments, particularly ones involving situational irony, fell short. However, these instances became less and less prevalent as the story progressed.
3. The slightly nebulous "lolrandom" cloud hanging over the first thread. Take this one with a grain of salt, seeing as you eventually tied everything together stylistically without glaring continuity and pacing issues.
Your positives definitely outweigh your negatives, so keep up the good work.
>>15000 Well, I started reading your story. I made it through the first few posts and then stopped reading, because in that short time I have already discovered the major problem with your story. It isn't a story. Its a random collection of shitposts that you tried to pass off as a story. There's no plot, there's no coherent cause and effect to anything that's going on, its just a bunch of lolrandom crap being flung around with no rhyme or reason.
So if you were trying to shitpost then mission accomplished. Your "story" is well and truly shit.
>>15003 Should I have kept reading? I think most people on this website would decide whether they would like a story or not within the first 3 updates. I read the first 10 updates and they were all shitposts, and I saw no signs of that changing any time soon.
Judging by >>15001 the story apparently stops being shitpost central at some unspecified point in the future, but seeing as how I would have to wade through a lake of shitposts to get to that point I have decided that its not worth the effort. I'm willing to bet that there are plenty of other potential new readers who would feel the same way and would be turned off by it too. If the writefag wanted us to take his story seriously, maybe he should have started his story seriously. As it stands, the story starts out as a bad joke, and since first impressions are everything I'm going to treat this story as a bad joke.
I honestly think >>15004 is a valid form of critique. His presence, opinions, and ability to influence others represents a fair and honest representation of the phenomenas occurrence, as derived from the subset of "chan" culture. Authors should definitely be mindful of this kind of thing when posting media online.
>>15005 >'starting your story with a dozen posts worth of unreadable unfunny shitposting is a bad idea' might be valid criticism
Thanks for your insight, captain genius. ""chan culture"" has nothing to do with it, I just don't want to read trash. Can you link me to the post in which the story *really starts*? I'll give it a shot then.
Probably not. I seem to be having a hard time finding a common wavelength of thought from which we both can approach this, despite my status as a genius. I don't want to come off as overly presumptuous. Again.
Eh, I don't think it matters in the end. We're all Anonymous users arguing from our respective, unassailable thrones. Personally, I'd be happy to discuss a witty repartee from either side of this argument. Purely for the sake of my own petty amusement.
Protag likes to shitpost Main character is consistent so far and somewhat well-written
Story revolves around protagonist, don't overdo that Updates are generally short-to-medium-length, yet updates are not frequent Not many possible directions story can take with a main character being literally a god No plot, central conflict, whatever - shoehorning plot/story would be worse, but it's still bad
You get six outta ten and advice to ignore people that hate funposting.
>>15001 >>15002 >>15012 Thanks for taking the time to post some good criticism. All three of you brought up valid points and I'll keep your posts in mind. That being said.
>>15004 >As it stands, the story starts out as a bad joke, and since first impressions are everything I'm going to treat this story as a bad joke. Coming from the author, I honestly side on him with this. Of course, I didn't do it anyway because I love being a hypocrite :^) but a shitty first impression is something that no reader should ignore.
>If the writefag wanted us to take his story seriously, maybe he should have started his story seriously. u rite
Let's start off with the romance elements. With both characters starting the story at maximum affinity for each other, where exactly do you intend to go from here? I hesitate to even call it a romance story since there's zero build-up, mystery, or chase associated with the whole affair. All-in-all, it's appropriate for a month long one-off, but leaves a lot to be desired as far as actual emotional expression and attachment goes.
As an example of what I'm referring to that you could improve on; you used "pout" and "blush" 14 and 18 times, respectively, throughout the course of a month. As things stand, youmu is more a physical manifestation of "cute" rather than a thinking, feeling character.
Moving forward, I'd recommend focusing more on expanding Youmu's intellectual side a bit. At the moment, it's kinda on the level of a several hundred year old dude dating a teenager, which is both awkward and creepy.
As far as the Slice of Life elements go, you definitely did a much better job. Always having a goal for us to pursue keep the story flowing at a good pace. The main thing here would be to better flesh out your supporting cast. Kogasa is doing pretty good, but everyone else reads like a cookie-cutter cut-out from the touhou wiki page. You're doing a good job with having them engaged in some sort of activity so they don't devolve into talking heads, but the missing piece here is motivation. I'd like to see a bit more exposition on why the characters exist in the current state we find them. Like...why was Tenshi bored enough to sit around people watching all day? Does she have a job? Friends? Some sort of purpose or goal she's pursuing? Why was Satori so busy she couldn't even offer some tea? World building is key in maintaining a good Slice of Life story.
>>15712 That's about what I expected. A little surprised at: >Always having a goal for us to pursue keep the story flowing at a good pace and: >You're doing a good job with having them engaged in some sort of activity so they don't devolve into talking heads since I didn't feel like I did enough there.
My only regret with the story is that I didn't get to go in depth with Youmu, because I was too focused on keeping things moving. Which in retrospect was counterproductive for a story focused on her.
Things to keep in mind as I move forward. I could make excuses like "I had planned for a full CYOA but cut it down for the month." and "If I had more time to write each update I could have done better." or maybe even "It was my first time writing something so far out of my comfort zone, so I was bound to make newbie mistakes." but they'd be just that, excuses.
An engaging read despite being based on such a cliché premise. particularly of note is how well you incorporate actions into your scenes. The way you use both idle and purposeful movements to break up the monotony between dialog is truly top tier on the site. An example of this would be how you emphasized the fact the Byakuren was physically trapped between Miko and Kokoro during the play scene. It really helped to keep her included in the parent/child dynamic of the scene without requiring much dialog on her part.
The biggest thing I'd like to see you improve on is how overpowered Miko is in terms of dealing with other characters. In the same way a shounen character might defeat an opponent with a single punch, Miko ability allows her to immediately pick the optimal 'solution' when interacting with others. Essentially, she is handed the win without any effort on her part. There's a certain satisfaction to picking good choices in CYoA. We, as readers, get the feeling that the time we spend contemplating choices was meaningful in some way. That feeling was notably absent in some of our dealings with supporting characters. I'd much prefer if her mind reading was a little more cryptic and ineffable so as to reflect the fleeting and inexact nature of thoughts.
Another minor issue is how focused the narrative is around the two protagonist. I can't recall a single instance where a character spoke to someone not named Miko or Byakuren. Again, not a huge deal, just a bit unrealistic.
I feel like an idiot for not noticing those myself.
I'd planned some proper serious social conflict, but somehow completely forgot to worry about such things on the way there. And I don't know what happened with the character focus.
Seriously though, thanks. I doubt I'll be able to do anything about it overnight, but now I've got something specific to focus on improving. Also, it's good to know I'm doing something right with the nonverbal stuff.
>>15801 >>15800 I can't make promises but the only way you'll get critique is if you put yourself out there. Maybe you'll get shit about not updating, too. Who knows? All I can tell you for sure is that you won't get either at this rate.
>>15798 You can just criticize me in whichever thread, and I have had that happen.
I don't like "roasts". Too mean, so they don't feel valuable. Even if it's just an exaggeration for "Critique me" I don't tend to ask for critique because I'm, well, confident. That's what makes unsolicited critique stand out very well, and I often listen to it and often try to address it best I can.
once again, that would be true if we were talking about a Edward X Remilia OTP story over on FF(dot)net. In situations that require feedback, response time is a key contributor to satisfaction. We are critiquing your CYoA in it's entirety, and update time is a big part of the experience.
>>15804 >just criticize me in whichever thread >anonymous I'll get right to it!
>I don't like "roasts". Too mean, so they don't feel valuable Have you actually read this thread?
>some bullshit about being a strong independent writer who don't need no critique but relishes it all the same Why the fuck are you even posting in this thread if you don't want to participate? You just sound like a tool by going out of your way to make excuses.
>>15806 >I'll get right to it! I'm saying if you have an issue in any thread you should feel free to voice it, apropos of nothing. >Have you actually read this thread? No : ) >>some bullshit about being a strong independent writer who don't need no critique but relishes it all the same >Why the fuck are you even posting in this thread if you don't want to participate? You just sound like a tool by going out of your way to make excuses. >>15795 >No one else willing to step up? >? A question. Though I too wasn't sure on what to, so I replied to this post instead >>15798 With an answer, as to why I hadn't participated. Does that answer your question of >Why the fuck are you even posting in this thread if you don't want to participate? ? Or will you continue to be angry.
I'm not going to pay lipservice either. I'm confident in my writing so I don't think about ASKING for ways I'm failing or, more to the point, ways to improve. I never have, though I imagine generally the sentiment to someone asking for criticism is "I am not confident in what I've written, so I'd like to ask outright what people could have issue with". That or it could be a whim of "tell me how I'm bad", but in either case I'm not interested. If my readers seem happy, I'm not inclined to think something needs changing. And though you seem to have gotten particularly bothered about >>some bullshit about being a strong independent writer who don't need no critique but relishes it all the same >>>but relishes it all the same this part, I don't know, I thought it was pretty obvious, but to clarify: if someone has an issue with what I've written, they can just tell me outright. If it bothered them enough to tell me even if I didn't ask for criticism, then it's probably a pretty serious problem, or at the very least worth reevaluating/addressing. It being unprompted stands out much more, and it being from invested readers is especially worthwhile.
But honestly I think this post will just make you more bothered and you won't care what I think, especially since I've just out and said "I feel confident in my writing". I mean objectively speaking that's pretty audacious and arrogant, but I'm honest about it.
>>15807 >No Ah, my bad for assuming that a reply made to a thread would be by someone who actually knew what its subject was about.
As for the other stuff, you're straight out misunderstanding what feedback is. Nearly every area of human activity (jobs, education, art) has feedback from peers as a normal part of the process. It has nothing to do with confidence. To close oneself off to opportunities to hear perspectives and alternatives they might have not otherwise contemplated is just stupid. Asking for critique isn't the same as admitting that you're doing a poor job nor is it born out of feelings of inferiority. In fact, being confident about yourself helps as having a third party point out things makes you hone arguments as to why you do the things you do and what it truly is you intend to achieve.
I may have been calling you out on being a tool when I thought that you knew what this process was about and what we were trying to accomplish. Now I just pity you: you're not confident, you're arrogant. If you ever do fuck up when writing, you'll have no one to blame but yourself even when it may have been otherwise avoided.
>>15808 >you're not confident, you're arrogant You can be both. I am both.
Pity all you like. I don't mind. Anyway if you want to read and comment on stories I'd say you should check out my stories in this order >>/shorts/2197 >>/shrine/41060 >>/underground/16139 >>/others/65260 And purely because that goes from shortest to longest. Teruyo did remind me that people on this site rarely say anything in the first place. I've already gotten unsolicited criticism on 3/4 of those and again, to be clear, I was not "tolerant" of that, I loved that. If you or anyone else lurking hate or love any of these stories you can tell me here or in any of those threads.
Roast me daddy Orchid Organizer !HgCXJCkx622022/01/29 (Sat) 19:59No. 16446▼
>>16446 Alright I looked at that forest story. The main criticism I can give is that the story is very meandering. When I was reading it, I got the feeling that things just sort of happen to Rumia instead of there being a central driving plot guiding Rumia. There used to be a central driving plot at the beginning, where a mysterious disembodied voice gave Rumia a mission to kill all the Anons and promised to guide Rumia on her adventure, but the voice just sort of vanished without explanation after Rumia killed the weird Alice goo monster and fell unconcious.
That's the other main criticism I have with this story. Characters and plot points have a nasty tendency to just sort of disappear from the story without warning. Take Wriggle for example. Wriggle ended up being killed by the Alice goo monster entirely offscreen, with no way for us to influence Wriggles fate. According to the Alice goo monster, it was entirely our fault that Wriggle died, even though the last thing we voted for prior to Wriggle's death was "lets try really hard to beat Wriggle to Marisa's house." Having the result of "lets race Wriggle" be "Wriggle is dead and its all your fault" seems like a rather extreme and unfairly unforeseeable consequence of our actions.
And Wriggle was one of the lucky ones, she actually got an explanation for her disappearance. Some characters don't even get that much. Like the Black Knight Anon that attacked us in Rinnosuke's shop. Rumia gets into a big fight with the knight, covers the area in darkness, and then the knight just sort of disappears. What happened to him, where did he go, what is he doing now? Who knows. He basically just fell out of the story with no explanation. A similar thing happened with the fairies Rumia met in the forest. Rumia attracts a horde of hundreds of fairies and runs to Reimu's shrine to escape them. Rumia spends maybe 10 minutes in the shrine and leaves with Shion through a window, and suddenly the fairies are gone, despite there being hundreds of fairies outside surrounding the shrine previously. And speaking of Shion, she just straight up disappears when we talk and fight with Marisa in the forest. Gonna be honest, when I read that part, I just sort of assumed that you had forgotten that Shion was there, stopped writing about her, and just sort of hoped nobody would notice her inexplicable disappearance when you did realize your mistake.
Yes we eventually found Shion again when we went back to Reimu's shrine, but that begs the question. If we hadn't gone back to Reimu's shrine, would we ever have found out what happened to Shion? Hypothetically, if we had gone to the Moriya shrine instead of Reimu's shrine, would Shion have remained disappeared? If that is the case, then Shion would have basically fallen through a plot hole never to be seen again from our perspective. And if that is how this story works, it also indicates that it is possible for us to miss essential plot points just because we didn't go to the right places at the right times. In fact that may have already happened. In one of the more recent updates, we talked to Eirin who told us that Rumia was dying, and had been dying ever since Rumia used the anon chainsaw to defend herself. Eirin also says that we could have avoided dying if we had come to Eientei sooner in our adventure, and its all our fault we are dying because we obviously should have known we were dying, and its too late to avoid dying now. Although there were hints that the chainsaw fused to our arm was doing something to us, there was no indication that whatever it was doing was fatal, or that we were on a time limit that would kill us if we didn't specifically go to Eientei fast enough. From my perspective as a reader, you basically just went, "Surprise! You are dead! And its all your fault! And there's nothing you can do about it!" Which seems kind of unfair to me.
I've read your criticism and firstly want to thank you for giving them. I'm sure it took some time to write all that and all of those are really good points that you're making.
Now I'm going to explain stuff as much as I can without making any sort of excuses for myself.
That was going to happen anyway, you are absolutely not responsible for that outcome. It's simply something the thing said to make you feel even worse at what it thought was going to be your last moments for that extra juicy tears. The thing was blatantly a sadist and deserved to die. (And would be a nice thing to suddenly remember if you ever you yourself making someone suffer for the same reasons only to end up disgusted by how similar to it you're acting since I don't have the guts to make Rumia into a total monster regardless of how much she hypes herself up to be one).
Wriggle's revival is meant to be a main motivator to keep moving even if you decided to simply not listen to some voice in your head that told you to eat some yummy outsiders. There were multiple ways to achieve it and you're already found one of them so I have to praise you for that.
Heck, once that's achieved.
Short words: He ran away, seeing how he was already wounded and saw you just cover yourself in darkness and sit on the ground it'd assume you had some counter attack in mind and decided to simply not risk it and run away. You could have pursued him by tracking him or choosing to lose your patience during the darkness waiting game. As for what's it doing now?
It's and its crew got found by Marisa and total party killed once they tried to ambush her. Had you been with her then you could have prevented her kleptomania from getting the better on her and not put on some obviously sus tiara. The rest is history.
For that one I simply wimped out, sure the Hakurei went ahead to go and exterminate a whole lot of them of her shrine after your ultimate genuflecting (and fairies would go down easily, some even running away) but I thought that the choice of letting her deal with the mess you brought only to be forced into a fight anyway since the place is surrounded would be a cheap shot, followed by an bigger cheap shot of Reimu coming back, seeing your attempt of just ditching your problems at her and getting a tad salty about it. (Since you didn't even offer to help) Followed by another cheap shot of that since she's so GENEROUISLY dealt with your fairy pest problem you'd have to do something for her like oh um...clean the entirety of her shrine while she calmly watches. At that point I figured that may be too much and may outright feel vindictive so I cancelled that like a coward. Which was really dumb.
She willingly did not help you out, and Rumia was kind of busy being assaulted at the time so most of her focus went on not getting her ass kicked. As for the Shrine stuff, that's actually a hard no. You would have definitely met with her again regardless of whether you the Hakurei or Moriya shrine the circumstances would simply be different (So you can't miss important moments even if you wanted to, otherwise the CYOA would be unplayable and honestly even if someone went and said "That's just like real life" even I would get peeved by it)
This isn't Majora's mask or something (If anyone doesn't know what that is it's basically repeating the same 3 days over and over while keeping mind of when and where plot point happens) , so not giving you that leeway would simply be pure bs.
>The Eirin one.
Are you certain that's the absolute truth though? there's been plenty of very unsubtle attempts of manipulating you by different people before, at this point I'd hope you learn to not trust someone just because and think more for yourself. That's the entire point of the doing things yourself route. Things would have been massively easier had you decided to listen to your guide or taken the option to listen to her again once she offered it but then again wouldn't you just be nothing more than a happy pawn? isn't she kind of petty for leaving you alone all this time only to change her mind or perhaps just remembering you were still alive? that kind of thing.
I do apologize for the feeling of unfairness though, maybe I should have let you readers know OOC that everything would be fine or something. Not sure how much info revealing is fine or not but that's not much of an excuse either.
Even so, I don't want you to feel like stuff is unfair or stacked too much against you. Because you do have a chance, others are simply trying to make you feel useless on your own.
I can however deal with these plot holes you see by simply showing you a glimpse of where those people currently are on the world map or a small cut-away to see what they're currently doing even though that gives you info that Rumia herself does not have.
Would you prefer I did that?
I'll do my best to use the info you've given me and will act on it to improve my writing
Also to do away with that feeling of meandering, things should be acting up soon anyway.
With that said, I'd love to hear your response and anyone else's criticism if they have any. Again thank you for giving it, it really means a lot to me.
Lost Soul!K7yo62LHdE2022/01/31 (Mon) 03:40No. 16450▼
You know what, I'll throw my story into the ring here. In particular, I'd like to know if there's anything in particular that works/doesn't work about my writing style, or any high/lowlights of note in the updates. A lot of what I've been doing has been making things up as I'm going along, so any feedback would be useful.